https://www.ventdev.com/forums/ Fri, 15 May 2026 23:32:34 +0000 MyBB https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=4680 Fri, 20 Jun 2025 13:40:24 -0400 SpartanSquire]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=4680 https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=4452 Thu, 31 Aug 2023 12:57:05 -0400 xjasilx]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=4452
I am new to the forums and a new benefactor, still finding my way around, and have a question I don't think I've seen addressed before.  

Context about me is probably worthwhile to understand where this question comes from: If there is a spectrum between the thematic (car design, theme park management, industrial development etc.) and economic sides of your typical tycoon game, I am lodged as far as one can go on the economic side of things.  I will play just about anything as long as the 'business' side of it is deep, complex, realistic, and challenging.  My absolute dream projects are a modern riff on Capitalism Lab and/or Wall Street Raider, a user-friendly commercial version of Vertonomics, and a full-featured nitty-gritty airline sim that is also not an MMO (hello everyone). No amount of economic detail is too much - and I mean that literally.

The absolute closest I have come to scratching the airline itch in the past isn't something like the various airline sim games that are also mostly MMOs.  In fact, I want so desperately to like airline sim (https://www.airlinesim.aero/en) that I have signed up and tooled around in it at least ten times, only to want to tear my hair out over the obtuse interface and hours of fiddling only to realize I was one fiddle short when the day resets/updates and I get to do it all again while shuttling zero passengers on zero flights flown.  [Honorable mention, however, to a game called Prosperous Universe from the same developer that I've sunk a ton of hours into - the only MMO-ish economy game I've ever played that avoided the pitfalls of the one-a-day turn slog.]  No, the closest I have come to getting my airline fix is a plug-in to MSFS called OnAir Company https://www.onair.company/.  It dynamically generates passengers, cargo, fuel, staff, funding, and other inputs and outputs that a player can pick up, deliver, and otherwise manage in a dynamic multiplayer world as a layer running behind the flights you simulate.  My PC is just decent enough to run MSFS on low settings, but it's not a particularly enjoyable experience to do so and I lack the diligence and available concurrent time to fly 15-hour long-haul flights just to make progress.  You can run OnAir stand-alone (i.e. separate from MSFS), but it's pretty hollow to do so.  

So, as I finally get around to the point, my suggestion is not very specific and is really more of a plea.  My dream for this game is to substitute the 'beefiness' of the car and component design aspects of GC with a robust economic model for AM which takes into consideration not just passenger and route dynamics but also freight, leasing, chartering, codeshares, brokering, the production cycles and reasonable routes for actual cargo types and economic drivers, and fluctuating reactions to supply and demand in not just ticket pricing but the overall economy as a whole.  I have no idea if this is reasonable - it's my own personal pipe dream.  I have seen Eric state things to the effect that the focus is not detailed plane design, a la GC, which is encouraging as it is consistent with the airline industry and my specific interests.  My hope/suggestion is for the enormous front end detail of GC to make its way into the back end of AM, allowing us to apply our own airline scope, scale, and strategy to a dynamic facsimile of the actual worldwide transport and logistics economy. And, to be clear, I respect and admire the degree of back-end detail already present in GC, it's the primary reason I purchased and enjoyed that game as well.

What is the current viewpoint/development path for the financial and non-passenger economy aspects of the game?  Is this something that's been discussed prior?  

As you can probably tell I am very excited for the game and appreciate this community and the active and meaningful involvement of the Devs.  Thanks!!

Jason]]>
I am new to the forums and a new benefactor, still finding my way around, and have a question I don't think I've seen addressed before.  

Context about me is probably worthwhile to understand where this question comes from: If there is a spectrum between the thematic (car design, theme park management, industrial development etc.) and economic sides of your typical tycoon game, I am lodged as far as one can go on the economic side of things.  I will play just about anything as long as the 'business' side of it is deep, complex, realistic, and challenging.  My absolute dream projects are a modern riff on Capitalism Lab and/or Wall Street Raider, a user-friendly commercial version of Vertonomics, and a full-featured nitty-gritty airline sim that is also not an MMO (hello everyone). No amount of economic detail is too much - and I mean that literally.

The absolute closest I have come to scratching the airline itch in the past isn't something like the various airline sim games that are also mostly MMOs.  In fact, I want so desperately to like airline sim (https://www.airlinesim.aero/en) that I have signed up and tooled around in it at least ten times, only to want to tear my hair out over the obtuse interface and hours of fiddling only to realize I was one fiddle short when the day resets/updates and I get to do it all again while shuttling zero passengers on zero flights flown.  [Honorable mention, however, to a game called Prosperous Universe from the same developer that I've sunk a ton of hours into - the only MMO-ish economy game I've ever played that avoided the pitfalls of the one-a-day turn slog.]  No, the closest I have come to getting my airline fix is a plug-in to MSFS called OnAir Company https://www.onair.company/.  It dynamically generates passengers, cargo, fuel, staff, funding, and other inputs and outputs that a player can pick up, deliver, and otherwise manage in a dynamic multiplayer world as a layer running behind the flights you simulate.  My PC is just decent enough to run MSFS on low settings, but it's not a particularly enjoyable experience to do so and I lack the diligence and available concurrent time to fly 15-hour long-haul flights just to make progress.  You can run OnAir stand-alone (i.e. separate from MSFS), but it's pretty hollow to do so.  

So, as I finally get around to the point, my suggestion is not very specific and is really more of a plea.  My dream for this game is to substitute the 'beefiness' of the car and component design aspects of GC with a robust economic model for AM which takes into consideration not just passenger and route dynamics but also freight, leasing, chartering, codeshares, brokering, the production cycles and reasonable routes for actual cargo types and economic drivers, and fluctuating reactions to supply and demand in not just ticket pricing but the overall economy as a whole.  I have no idea if this is reasonable - it's my own personal pipe dream.  I have seen Eric state things to the effect that the focus is not detailed plane design, a la GC, which is encouraging as it is consistent with the airline industry and my specific interests.  My hope/suggestion is for the enormous front end detail of GC to make its way into the back end of AM, allowing us to apply our own airline scope, scale, and strategy to a dynamic facsimile of the actual worldwide transport and logistics economy. And, to be clear, I respect and admire the degree of back-end detail already present in GC, it's the primary reason I purchased and enjoyed that game as well.

What is the current viewpoint/development path for the financial and non-passenger economy aspects of the game?  Is this something that's been discussed prior?  

As you can probably tell I am very excited for the game and appreciate this community and the active and meaningful involvement of the Devs.  Thanks!!

Jason]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=4418 Sat, 29 Apr 2023 19:47:20 -0400 jerrod247]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=4418
1. The traffic flowing though an airport should help determine growth instead of expansion being entirely based off historical events. This could allow a player to chose to fly into a alternate airport in a given city to the one that became large in the real world and have that grow instead. This could also allow for a player to obtain more space in hub airport.

2. I think this has been brought up before but if you buy lots of planes from someone like Corvair for example it doesn't make sense for them to just disappear when they would of been profitable.

3. If alliances are in the game I would like to see the other airlines in the alliance look to make routes that connect into your system so passengers can utilize the alliance properly.


I am excited to see how this game turns out.
Best of luck!]]>
1. The traffic flowing though an airport should help determine growth instead of expansion being entirely based off historical events. This could allow a player to chose to fly into a alternate airport in a given city to the one that became large in the real world and have that grow instead. This could also allow for a player to obtain more space in hub airport.

2. I think this has been brought up before but if you buy lots of planes from someone like Corvair for example it doesn't make sense for them to just disappear when they would of been profitable.

3. If alliances are in the game I would like to see the other airlines in the alliance look to make routes that connect into your system so passengers can utilize the alliance properly.


I am excited to see how this game turns out.
Best of luck!]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=4407 Sun, 26 Feb 2023 06:38:07 -0500 SamFM]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=4407 I play a lot of hardcore simracing games, and at the same time, very old (usually) but "fruity" in-depth management games. My game library consists of such titles like Airline Tycoon 1, Aerobiz Supersonic, Pharaoh, Capitalism II, Gearcity (of course!), Airbucks, Ocean Trader, F1 Manager 2022, F1 Manager Professional, etc.. 

Instead of copying most of other guys wrote here, I will try to share a "mood board" of games that, in my opinion, should impact AeroMogul. 
I really can't stand online-only games and MMORPG, etc. So I will not put them here. Their number on the list don't really matter.

1) Aerobiz Supersonic. Because, to have a inviting and interesting game, you don't have to show player a lot of stats and data. Because, first and foremost, it's a game. And people play games to get entertained. I'm not telling that game shouldn't try to be historically accurate, but the game mechanics and immersion is much more important for average player. 

Also, Aerobiz even though, looks simple, has a nice simulation of most Airline management aspects, including focus on human relations (relations with plane manufacturers, governments and own board of directors), developing and managing hubs and routes, pricing, marketing and business ventures. BTW, they still managed to include historically accurate planes and manufacturers.

2) Airline Tycoon 1. Because, this game is a good example of good visualization style that, on the other hand, covers pretty serious economic model. Also, AT1 has very good scheduling and side jobs (charter) mechanics and visuals. For me, finding charter flights was more interesting than having an own route working.

3) Ocean Trader (DOS game). Because it shows pretty good variety of random events occurring to your company and ships.

4) F1 Manager Professional (1996 DOS game by Software 2000 developer). Because it's a very in-depth game managing to put a nice visualizations over several F1 real life processes like tuning the engine (mini-game) before race, assembling the car and looking parts wear, purchasing parts. I think the UI will be useful to study before the Aeromogul development

My best wishes to the VENT team. I sincerely hope the AeroMogul will be even more success than GearCity.]]> I play a lot of hardcore simracing games, and at the same time, very old (usually) but "fruity" in-depth management games. My game library consists of such titles like Airline Tycoon 1, Aerobiz Supersonic, Pharaoh, Capitalism II, Gearcity (of course!), Airbucks, Ocean Trader, F1 Manager 2022, F1 Manager Professional, etc.. 

Instead of copying most of other guys wrote here, I will try to share a "mood board" of games that, in my opinion, should impact AeroMogul. 
I really can't stand online-only games and MMORPG, etc. So I will not put them here. Their number on the list don't really matter.

1) Aerobiz Supersonic. Because, to have a inviting and interesting game, you don't have to show player a lot of stats and data. Because, first and foremost, it's a game. And people play games to get entertained. I'm not telling that game shouldn't try to be historically accurate, but the game mechanics and immersion is much more important for average player. 

Also, Aerobiz even though, looks simple, has a nice simulation of most Airline management aspects, including focus on human relations (relations with plane manufacturers, governments and own board of directors), developing and managing hubs and routes, pricing, marketing and business ventures. BTW, they still managed to include historically accurate planes and manufacturers.

2) Airline Tycoon 1. Because, this game is a good example of good visualization style that, on the other hand, covers pretty serious economic model. Also, AT1 has very good scheduling and side jobs (charter) mechanics and visuals. For me, finding charter flights was more interesting than having an own route working.

3) Ocean Trader (DOS game). Because it shows pretty good variety of random events occurring to your company and ships.

4) F1 Manager Professional (1996 DOS game by Software 2000 developer). Because it's a very in-depth game managing to put a nice visualizations over several F1 real life processes like tuning the engine (mini-game) before race, assembling the car and looking parts wear, purchasing parts. I think the UI will be useful to study before the Aeromogul development

My best wishes to the VENT team. I sincerely hope the AeroMogul will be even more success than GearCity.]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=2833 Fri, 08 Jan 2016 18:36:35 -0500 Curse]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=2833
After playing Counter-Strike and World of Warcraft on world top level for over a decade, I started playing AirwaySim as well as AirlineSim several years ago before I went inactive there due to lack of skilled competition and, from my point of view, necessary features.
As I had and have involvements with developments there I may not go into full detail in public with everything as I respect the developers and games there as well.
I'm also creator of the AWS FAQ (http://www.airwaysim.com/forum/index.php...706.0.html), the (old?) manual and most likely most of the bug and feature reports there as well as CEO of King Airways, #1 airline in lots of gameworlds and manager of SkyConnect, Elite and -X-.



1) City based demand.
What is most likely the most complex thing to develop is also the feature that isn't implemented in any of the known games yet in a good state.

City based demand does not just include connected pax. City based demand is the idea to form the world. I love to describe this feature in an example:

It's 1946, World War II just ended. Take your home town or your favorite place. To make things easy for this example, let's say this is Columbus, Ohio, USA (I chose this city right now randomly from Google Maps!).
Columbus isn't a huge city, but decent, and in real life the airport is small.

With a few bucks some old USAAF C-47/DC-3 are purchased and the first connections start. Why would people fly to Columbo? Of course because it's not their destination, but it's a hub. In the early era, without mid- and long-range aircraft, coast to coast flights aren't possible anyway, so our airline concept is to make people connect between the coasts but also between north and south during Columbus.

The city of course prospers due to this, like in real life Atlanta did and still does.

As ranges of aircraft get longer, and we have to wait long for that, mostly for the DC-8/707 era before more efficient 727-100/ and later 727-200Adv took over, we not just built up a good airline reputation, a nice fleet of aircraft and a cash stockpile. But also Columbus is a way bigger city than it was actually in real world at the same time and the airport expanded several times to meet demand of our airline and others that try to take shares of our cake.

We now either can open a hub at a coast city to get in the nonstop coast to coast business, forming a triangle with Columbus, or we skip that and just try to get coast to coast pax and cargo with cheap tickets, very good service, or just our overwhelming image - whatever suits the strategy best we had developed the 30 years before this.

As soon as international flights start we can do that, too. Yes, from Columbus, Ohio. Of course our pax have to change flights most of the time, but that's life. Hub systems are still the most common system in the real world.

So, how would that look in 2016? Maybe Columbus would not have 835k inhabitants as it has in real world, but maybe 4 Millions. Why not? Atlanta basically made the same, not speaking of several Arab cities/airlines trying for that. And you could reach every point in the world from there. Nonstop flight to Auckland, NZ? Of course! Nonstop to Moscow? Why not.

In the same time in our game there was no airline in Atlanta. So Atlanta has a small airport with a single runway and less inhabitants - who wants to live in a city that is just connected to a few other cities?


And now scale this down and up. You can start in a small airport in the Pacific (I made a similar example in the AirwaySim Forums with Tahiti, no link because reasons, but it's easy to find) and just keep your airline little while making your "home island" the hub there.
Or let's get a step higher. Think about founding the same huge airline in New York City. Or Los Angeles.

Or think about expanding Frankfurt, Germany, before the Green party basically made expansion impossible and even prohibit the night flight ban.

THAT is city based demand. YOU create the world, or at least the game makes you think so.

AirwaySim and other games get boring because it is the same. Everytime. I even have a spreadsheet for Los Angeles that, and I'm 100% sure about that, can even get the biggest noob a #3 airline because it's step by step for building routes and which aircraft to use when.

City based demand creates a new experience everytime and this experience is build around the player.


2) Manufacturer Image
Many games simply ignore the fight between manufacturers. In real world airlines get benefits if they decide to change the manufacturer or, other way around, get penalized if they ignore a manufacturer.

PanAm for example had huge influence for a very long time with Boeing and Douglas, not only giving us aircraft like the 747, but also making sure PanAm was the premium customer for those aircraft (ok, it didn't help PanAm, but that's not the point ).

Another example, as I love them so much:
1960, you start your business, and go for Douglas because they offered some cheap aircraft the second you looked for some. You earn a bit money and start to purchase more used and new aircraft from Douglas, they recognize you as a loyal customer and give you benefits, like better discount. You keep growing your Douglas fleet and one day a Douglas dude shows up at your office. They want to introduce a new aircraft, but
a) they need initial orders
b) they need information about specifications (you like 100 or 120 seats more?)
c) they offer premium delivery slots for their premium customers, meaning more aircraft soon after release for you.

At the same time Boeing in Seattle gets mad. They tried to offer you some obscene discounts last round you were out looking for aircraft, but you went again for Douglas. Now they announce their 747, Douglas can't compete.. and Boeing is not really willing to help you out. Yes, of course, you can get 747. No problem. Prices are in the book. Discount? lol! Premium delivery? Never, please wait 3 years before even East South Bangladeshi Crash Airlines received their single 747.
But what if you keep purchasing 747 anyway? Some day they will offer you a small discount for their new 737. And 30 years later maybe you guys are best buddys, not just premium partners, but also having nice pool parties together.

That's a similar dynamic system. It gives the player at least the idea the game is about and around him - not he has to fill out a static world that is the same every round.


3) Dynamic Airports:

This is also based on the idea in #1, therefor it is not important how an airport is today, important is
a) what was the airport in 1946, at least somehow
b) ignore the real world data and simply start 1946 with generic airports for city sizes, like: huge city 3000m concrete runway+1 real Terminal, smaller cities 2000m concrete+1 real Terminal, towns 1000m grass+no real terminal (and therefor way slower handling) or whatever. Keep it simple but make it modular and dynamic.

Airports then can be, 1) and 2) options included, expanded in several ways:
I) Player based.
I have an airline in Oklahoma and I need more than 2000m runway for my new 727 aircraft. So I go to authorities and tell them: Hey, gief! I either have to pay the whole sum or it's shared between me, the city, and maybe other airlines HQ'd there.
II) City based.
City says we expand the runway or build a new terminal. They do so. Enjoy.
III) Other airline based.
Maybe they just pay for it and you enjoy. Maybe they ask you to pay a share of the cost and if you decline it is either built anyway (as they just tried to keep their costs down) or you gambled too high and there is no expansion.


This should only be limited by an either hard coded limit (that should be visible at the start and all the time) or diminishing returns, maybe later also due to politics.
It's obvious this airport on the Galapagos Islands never will have 10x 5000m runways. It's also obvious Hong Kong will never have an airport of 10x 5000m, at least until very late in the years when we have technology for artifical islands. But New York City could. Why not make JFK some kind of huge behemoth airport thing?


4) What Airports should be in the game:

Something more basic.

I have no idea about coding, but I can imagine a system like this:
Most important xxx hundred or thousand airports of the world. For my tase AirwaySim has way too many "crap nobody ever will use that"-airports, just to give an example.

However, I think it is crucial to give the player the possibility to add an own airport, like you can create your own sports team with town in some games or your own racing car team. If the player adds the name of the place, the name of the airport, the population, the wealth level (as long as it isn't pulled from the country or region list), the coordinates and the metropol population and infrastructure (highway, rail, port), the game should be able to handle it perfectly.

My home town for example has no actual airport but it would actually make a very nice hub for a German or Europe (domestic) hub airline, especially Cargo.


Also I think it's crucial to decide how deep one wants to go. What I find in AirwaySim are often two situations:
a) There are enough airports in a country but not enough demand, for example Papua New Guines.
b) There are not enough airports implemented into the game to make a domestic airline fun, like Germany or Argentinia.

I don't know the saying in English, but I think it's either full or nothing. Nobody needs 10 airports in Argentinia as they serve no purpose internationally, even with city based demand. For a domestic airline we need way more airports, otherwise it would be enough to give the 5 biggest cities their airport (simplified, maybe Argentinia has 7 worthy cities).


5) Easy way to mod, at least names of aircraft and airports:

I guess you want to use phantasy names for the game. That is fine, as long as the names can be changed easy and fast. If there is an editor it should be possible to change a manufacturer name as it is, for example "Loolheat" to "Lockheed" without changing every single of their 80 aircraft models. Or at least in a format that easily supports "change all"-options...

I actually like the easy text files Paradox uses for their games.




So, however, those are some of my ideas and I, as a new guy here around, won't spam too much. If there's interest as well in my suggestions as in the game project itself (ref: http://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread...85#pid7385 ) , I would be happy to contribute more. Here or in a more private environment.
That of course includes my offer for testing and things, I did (and still do) this for other games, too. Some say I'm just a cheesy bastard always playing on the edge, I call it bug and exploit finding. ]]>
After playing Counter-Strike and World of Warcraft on world top level for over a decade, I started playing AirwaySim as well as AirlineSim several years ago before I went inactive there due to lack of skilled competition and, from my point of view, necessary features.
As I had and have involvements with developments there I may not go into full detail in public with everything as I respect the developers and games there as well.
I'm also creator of the AWS FAQ (http://www.airwaysim.com/forum/index.php...706.0.html), the (old?) manual and most likely most of the bug and feature reports there as well as CEO of King Airways, #1 airline in lots of gameworlds and manager of SkyConnect, Elite and -X-.



1) City based demand.
What is most likely the most complex thing to develop is also the feature that isn't implemented in any of the known games yet in a good state.

City based demand does not just include connected pax. City based demand is the idea to form the world. I love to describe this feature in an example:

It's 1946, World War II just ended. Take your home town or your favorite place. To make things easy for this example, let's say this is Columbus, Ohio, USA (I chose this city right now randomly from Google Maps!).
Columbus isn't a huge city, but decent, and in real life the airport is small.

With a few bucks some old USAAF C-47/DC-3 are purchased and the first connections start. Why would people fly to Columbo? Of course because it's not their destination, but it's a hub. In the early era, without mid- and long-range aircraft, coast to coast flights aren't possible anyway, so our airline concept is to make people connect between the coasts but also between north and south during Columbus.

The city of course prospers due to this, like in real life Atlanta did and still does.

As ranges of aircraft get longer, and we have to wait long for that, mostly for the DC-8/707 era before more efficient 727-100/ and later 727-200Adv took over, we not just built up a good airline reputation, a nice fleet of aircraft and a cash stockpile. But also Columbus is a way bigger city than it was actually in real world at the same time and the airport expanded several times to meet demand of our airline and others that try to take shares of our cake.

We now either can open a hub at a coast city to get in the nonstop coast to coast business, forming a triangle with Columbus, or we skip that and just try to get coast to coast pax and cargo with cheap tickets, very good service, or just our overwhelming image - whatever suits the strategy best we had developed the 30 years before this.

As soon as international flights start we can do that, too. Yes, from Columbus, Ohio. Of course our pax have to change flights most of the time, but that's life. Hub systems are still the most common system in the real world.

So, how would that look in 2016? Maybe Columbus would not have 835k inhabitants as it has in real world, but maybe 4 Millions. Why not? Atlanta basically made the same, not speaking of several Arab cities/airlines trying for that. And you could reach every point in the world from there. Nonstop flight to Auckland, NZ? Of course! Nonstop to Moscow? Why not.

In the same time in our game there was no airline in Atlanta. So Atlanta has a small airport with a single runway and less inhabitants - who wants to live in a city that is just connected to a few other cities?


And now scale this down and up. You can start in a small airport in the Pacific (I made a similar example in the AirwaySim Forums with Tahiti, no link because reasons, but it's easy to find) and just keep your airline little while making your "home island" the hub there.
Or let's get a step higher. Think about founding the same huge airline in New York City. Or Los Angeles.

Or think about expanding Frankfurt, Germany, before the Green party basically made expansion impossible and even prohibit the night flight ban.

THAT is city based demand. YOU create the world, or at least the game makes you think so.

AirwaySim and other games get boring because it is the same. Everytime. I even have a spreadsheet for Los Angeles that, and I'm 100% sure about that, can even get the biggest noob a #3 airline because it's step by step for building routes and which aircraft to use when.

City based demand creates a new experience everytime and this experience is build around the player.


2) Manufacturer Image
Many games simply ignore the fight between manufacturers. In real world airlines get benefits if they decide to change the manufacturer or, other way around, get penalized if they ignore a manufacturer.

PanAm for example had huge influence for a very long time with Boeing and Douglas, not only giving us aircraft like the 747, but also making sure PanAm was the premium customer for those aircraft (ok, it didn't help PanAm, but that's not the point ).

Another example, as I love them so much:
1960, you start your business, and go for Douglas because they offered some cheap aircraft the second you looked for some. You earn a bit money and start to purchase more used and new aircraft from Douglas, they recognize you as a loyal customer and give you benefits, like better discount. You keep growing your Douglas fleet and one day a Douglas dude shows up at your office. They want to introduce a new aircraft, but
a) they need initial orders
b) they need information about specifications (you like 100 or 120 seats more?)
c) they offer premium delivery slots for their premium customers, meaning more aircraft soon after release for you.

At the same time Boeing in Seattle gets mad. They tried to offer you some obscene discounts last round you were out looking for aircraft, but you went again for Douglas. Now they announce their 747, Douglas can't compete.. and Boeing is not really willing to help you out. Yes, of course, you can get 747. No problem. Prices are in the book. Discount? lol! Premium delivery? Never, please wait 3 years before even East South Bangladeshi Crash Airlines received their single 747.
But what if you keep purchasing 747 anyway? Some day they will offer you a small discount for their new 737. And 30 years later maybe you guys are best buddys, not just premium partners, but also having nice pool parties together.

That's a similar dynamic system. It gives the player at least the idea the game is about and around him - not he has to fill out a static world that is the same every round.


3) Dynamic Airports:

This is also based on the idea in #1, therefor it is not important how an airport is today, important is
a) what was the airport in 1946, at least somehow
b) ignore the real world data and simply start 1946 with generic airports for city sizes, like: huge city 3000m concrete runway+1 real Terminal, smaller cities 2000m concrete+1 real Terminal, towns 1000m grass+no real terminal (and therefor way slower handling) or whatever. Keep it simple but make it modular and dynamic.

Airports then can be, 1) and 2) options included, expanded in several ways:
I) Player based.
I have an airline in Oklahoma and I need more than 2000m runway for my new 727 aircraft. So I go to authorities and tell them: Hey, gief! I either have to pay the whole sum or it's shared between me, the city, and maybe other airlines HQ'd there.
II) City based.
City says we expand the runway or build a new terminal. They do so. Enjoy.
III) Other airline based.
Maybe they just pay for it and you enjoy. Maybe they ask you to pay a share of the cost and if you decline it is either built anyway (as they just tried to keep their costs down) or you gambled too high and there is no expansion.


This should only be limited by an either hard coded limit (that should be visible at the start and all the time) or diminishing returns, maybe later also due to politics.
It's obvious this airport on the Galapagos Islands never will have 10x 5000m runways. It's also obvious Hong Kong will never have an airport of 10x 5000m, at least until very late in the years when we have technology for artifical islands. But New York City could. Why not make JFK some kind of huge behemoth airport thing?


4) What Airports should be in the game:

Something more basic.

I have no idea about coding, but I can imagine a system like this:
Most important xxx hundred or thousand airports of the world. For my tase AirwaySim has way too many "crap nobody ever will use that"-airports, just to give an example.

However, I think it is crucial to give the player the possibility to add an own airport, like you can create your own sports team with town in some games or your own racing car team. If the player adds the name of the place, the name of the airport, the population, the wealth level (as long as it isn't pulled from the country or region list), the coordinates and the metropol population and infrastructure (highway, rail, port), the game should be able to handle it perfectly.

My home town for example has no actual airport but it would actually make a very nice hub for a German or Europe (domestic) hub airline, especially Cargo.


Also I think it's crucial to decide how deep one wants to go. What I find in AirwaySim are often two situations:
a) There are enough airports in a country but not enough demand, for example Papua New Guines.
b) There are not enough airports implemented into the game to make a domestic airline fun, like Germany or Argentinia.

I don't know the saying in English, but I think it's either full or nothing. Nobody needs 10 airports in Argentinia as they serve no purpose internationally, even with city based demand. For a domestic airline we need way more airports, otherwise it would be enough to give the 5 biggest cities their airport (simplified, maybe Argentinia has 7 worthy cities).


5) Easy way to mod, at least names of aircraft and airports:

I guess you want to use phantasy names for the game. That is fine, as long as the names can be changed easy and fast. If there is an editor it should be possible to change a manufacturer name as it is, for example "Loolheat" to "Lockheed" without changing every single of their 80 aircraft models. Or at least in a format that easily supports "change all"-options...

I actually like the easy text files Paradox uses for their games.




So, however, those are some of my ideas and I, as a new guy here around, won't spam too much. If there's interest as well in my suggestions as in the game project itself (ref: http://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread...85#pid7385 ) , I would be happy to contribute more. Here or in a more private environment.
That of course includes my offer for testing and things, I did (and still do) this for other games, too. Some say I'm just a cheesy bastard always playing on the edge, I call it bug and exploit finding. ]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=2625 Fri, 27 Mar 2015 23:26:21 -0400 Technotron3]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=2625
1. Time: I like the month by month time frame such as in Gear City. Ive seen other sims take it quarterly, but I feel that the game goes way too fast.

2. AI: AI should be competitive but not over or under powered. there will also need to be parameters for different types of airlines. Spirit is a ultra-low cost airlines, while southwest is a low cost. there is a difference, and then there is our full service airlines like American or Delta.

3. Manufactures: I Like the idea in another thread but I think his initial idea is not what this game would be about (though that would be a neat new sim) I think there should be 4 ways to get planes.
1.Direct Purchase: Directly Purchase from the manufactures
2.Lease(both used and new): Shorter Delivery if deliverered new and used can be obtained immediately. (may or may not be canceled, if so, at a premium unless it passes a certain timeframe)
3.Used: Used Planes on the market(varying condition and Mechanical records :O)
4.Loan: Similar to lease, but is meant to pay off the plane so prices can be somewhat higher per month and can be canceled(at a premium)

I also Like the idea of influencing capacities of aircraft as that is what shaped many early airliners. Maybe allow for a base model that allows users to but a sub code for a special order (737-800ER, 737-800EC(extra capacity), 737-800ES(extra speed), 737-80EP (Enhanced Powerplant). Each extra development requested will require a fee for research and dev. or a minimum order.

3. Maintenance: Location, Location, Location! You can use the local shop for a premium, you could fly it to the manufactures nearest facilaty, you could use your own In-House Center, or use a competitor's if an agreement is shared or in an alliance(if the alliance offers this option).

4. Game Zone: Just want to fly through NA, or only in Europe? there should be an option that allows you to control the playing zone.

5. Hubs Hubs gain connecting traffic as routes expand, but can also be affected by direct routes that may bypass a hub. Maintenance and Airport fess are decreased. Traffic bonus.
Maybe a calc on the % of passengers by a region such as a plane from Europe arrives and say ...

20% are at their final Destination
20% are to U.S. East Coast (includes Regional)
15% Central U.s.
10% Caribbean
5% Latin America
10% U.S. West Coast
10% Canada
5% South America
5% Random

If the decision is made to allow airport expansions, airlines should be able to purchase or built terminals at hub airports.]]>
1. Time: I like the month by month time frame such as in Gear City. Ive seen other sims take it quarterly, but I feel that the game goes way too fast.

2. AI: AI should be competitive but not over or under powered. there will also need to be parameters for different types of airlines. Spirit is a ultra-low cost airlines, while southwest is a low cost. there is a difference, and then there is our full service airlines like American or Delta.

3. Manufactures: I Like the idea in another thread but I think his initial idea is not what this game would be about (though that would be a neat new sim) I think there should be 4 ways to get planes.
1.Direct Purchase: Directly Purchase from the manufactures
2.Lease(both used and new): Shorter Delivery if deliverered new and used can be obtained immediately. (may or may not be canceled, if so, at a premium unless it passes a certain timeframe)
3.Used: Used Planes on the market(varying condition and Mechanical records :O)
4.Loan: Similar to lease, but is meant to pay off the plane so prices can be somewhat higher per month and can be canceled(at a premium)

I also Like the idea of influencing capacities of aircraft as that is what shaped many early airliners. Maybe allow for a base model that allows users to but a sub code for a special order (737-800ER, 737-800EC(extra capacity), 737-800ES(extra speed), 737-80EP (Enhanced Powerplant). Each extra development requested will require a fee for research and dev. or a minimum order.

3. Maintenance: Location, Location, Location! You can use the local shop for a premium, you could fly it to the manufactures nearest facilaty, you could use your own In-House Center, or use a competitor's if an agreement is shared or in an alliance(if the alliance offers this option).

4. Game Zone: Just want to fly through NA, or only in Europe? there should be an option that allows you to control the playing zone.

5. Hubs Hubs gain connecting traffic as routes expand, but can also be affected by direct routes that may bypass a hub. Maintenance and Airport fess are decreased. Traffic bonus.
Maybe a calc on the % of passengers by a region such as a plane from Europe arrives and say ...

20% are at their final Destination
20% are to U.S. East Coast (includes Regional)
15% Central U.s.
10% Caribbean
5% Latin America
10% U.S. West Coast
10% Canada
5% South America
5% Random

If the decision is made to allow airport expansions, airlines should be able to purchase or built terminals at hub airports.]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=2563 Wed, 21 Jan 2015 10:05:05 -0500 zane94s]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=2563
The ability to be an aircraft manufacturer. There is no such game out there, and you have the tools from GearCity which allows the player to model an object (car design, and possible Aircraft design). Then, the ability to go through the entire build process (just like cars), and afterwards naming and branding the aircraft.

The final step is selling them to airlines around the globe.

The player may have the option to be a manufacturer or an airline manager at the beginning of the game]]>
The ability to be an aircraft manufacturer. There is no such game out there, and you have the tools from GearCity which allows the player to model an object (car design, and possible Aircraft design). Then, the ability to go through the entire build process (just like cars), and afterwards naming and branding the aircraft.

The final step is selling them to airlines around the globe.

The player may have the option to be a manufacturer or an airline manager at the beginning of the game]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=368 Fri, 29 Mar 2013 20:51:22 -0400 Corwin86]]> https://www.ventdev.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=368

I was thinking (while I was playing Gear City, PcFantacanestro and AirwaySim) how to give some ideas and "stakes", about what and what not to include to this game:

- I start saying that Gear City is simply awesome, also in BETA, and I expect the same from this future game

Examples:
- in the past there been a couple of decent airline simulator, but I think that all are now "outdated" (maybe only "Airpro 7" and "Airline 7", why always 7???, are the the only that are actually "updated", but I still have to try them http://www.airpro-game.com, http://www.airlinesimulation.com) so...
- watch especially for Web airline simulation!!!
- here there is an interesting post about some (I think, the major ones) simulation to "test" (http://www.airline-empires.com/index.php...you-tryed/)
- http://www.airwaysim.com, http://www.airline-empires.com, http://www.airlinemogul.com: these three seems to be the best actually on the market...
- DO NOT look for "Airline Sim" and "Cyber Airlines", I don't give you the specific link, because my McAfee (always be praised) saved me from an attack from these sites

General game idea:
- please do NOT create a game like "Airlines Tycoon 1 & 2": is simply crap! All these "cartoons" styles game are often dull and boring, and I (we) need a serious cool simulation
- start in 1946 (1950), end in a possible, near future (not cyberpunk style, I like science fiction, but not in an air simulation game )
- create various, challenging scenarios...
- ... and a GREAT sandbox mode (this is very, very important)

Specific suggestions:
- try (I know, is difficult) a game that can support little, small, medium, large and huge companies... What it means? It can be awesome, if you can open a very small company, and then freely decide (if you don't have fixed goals) into a larger one... and small and medium aircraft have their large and "true" world...
- have a huge database! (airplanes, but also airports, and possible routes...)
- it'a a large work to do, but I think you have to consider how the "conditions" affects routes and market (summer-winter, ex-colonies, countries that are usually "resorts" for other countries, wars, international crises...)
- ...so, try to make a "real" and "living" world! With events and other
- This, and this are good ideas...
- DO NOT have the user to fly aircraft manually! Is really annoying and impossible to do after ten single aircraft...

Last suggestion: when the game is ready, hype it, because I realized, in my little research, that there are three-four competitors for web games, but only TWO (serious one, I will surely buy them, but... God, they seems like a program for the creation of the family budget, from what they are graphically dull; and "Airline 7" cost 50, I MEAN, 50 €€€!) competitor for normal game... and there is request and a market

And it's really all, for now
I will try (I think) "Airline Empires", "Airpro 7" and "Airline 7", and with already "AirwaySim", I will have better ideas in the future ]]>

I was thinking (while I was playing Gear City, PcFantacanestro and AirwaySim) how to give some ideas and "stakes", about what and what not to include to this game:

- I start saying that Gear City is simply awesome, also in BETA, and I expect the same from this future game

Examples:
- in the past there been a couple of decent airline simulator, but I think that all are now "outdated" (maybe only "Airpro 7" and "Airline 7", why always 7???, are the the only that are actually "updated", but I still have to try them http://www.airpro-game.com, http://www.airlinesimulation.com) so...
- watch especially for Web airline simulation!!!
- here there is an interesting post about some (I think, the major ones) simulation to "test" (http://www.airline-empires.com/index.php...you-tryed/)
- http://www.airwaysim.com, http://www.airline-empires.com, http://www.airlinemogul.com: these three seems to be the best actually on the market...
- DO NOT look for "Airline Sim" and "Cyber Airlines", I don't give you the specific link, because my McAfee (always be praised) saved me from an attack from these sites

General game idea:
- please do NOT create a game like "Airlines Tycoon 1 & 2": is simply crap! All these "cartoons" styles game are often dull and boring, and I (we) need a serious cool simulation
- start in 1946 (1950), end in a possible, near future (not cyberpunk style, I like science fiction, but not in an air simulation game )
- create various, challenging scenarios...
- ... and a GREAT sandbox mode (this is very, very important)

Specific suggestions:
- try (I know, is difficult) a game that can support little, small, medium, large and huge companies... What it means? It can be awesome, if you can open a very small company, and then freely decide (if you don't have fixed goals) into a larger one... and small and medium aircraft have their large and "true" world...
- have a huge database! (airplanes, but also airports, and possible routes...)
- it'a a large work to do, but I think you have to consider how the "conditions" affects routes and market (summer-winter, ex-colonies, countries that are usually "resorts" for other countries, wars, international crises...)
- ...so, try to make a "real" and "living" world! With events and other
- This, and this are good ideas...
- DO NOT have the user to fly aircraft manually! Is really annoying and impossible to do after ten single aircraft...

Last suggestion: when the game is ready, hype it, because I realized, in my little research, that there are three-four competitors for web games, but only TWO (serious one, I will surely buy them, but... God, they seems like a program for the creation of the family budget, from what they are graphically dull; and "Airline 7" cost 50, I MEAN, 50 €€€!) competitor for normal game... and there is request and a market

And it's really all, for now
I will try (I think) "Airline Empires", "Airpro 7" and "Airline 7", and with already "AirwaySim", I will have better ideas in the future ]]>